Yes. Okay.
Hello, everyone welcome to this special session of growing up in science.
My name is Wakeiva, i'm a professor of Neuroscience and say quality, and to New York University and and growing up in science is a series in which we explore the human side behind the side.
So the stories that behind the CD we often get speakers to talk about their life and career story within, with a special focus on the things that went wrong down detours, struggles, and and once a year we have this special event where
we get the stories from behind credits to this school, and this, hopefully will be a useful source of information for those of you who are.
Think of applying to grad school and maybe even if you're already there, and want to get all the perspectives on, and mentorship and and work life, penance, and not not culture, etc.
This event is also part of the virtual Summer research internship organized by M.
Who psychology program in which, we work on skill, development, hidden curriculum, mentoring as well as and actually research.
And for students who are interested in trying to Pc. programs.
Did the Pc. program here today's session will be moderated and and has been organized by Swissy Arnold.
She's, Bc. student in the security department at Mit and all that, Sophie, and take it from here in June.
Just the panelists. Okay, Thank you. raise you for the introduction.
So. yes, my name is Sophie and today. we're going to be running a panel on what I wish I had known about doing a PHD.
And we're going to to be hearing from for current PHD.
Student panelists. So Ajudica is a fifth year. PHD.
Candidate in social psychology at Yale University, under the mentorship of Dr.
Jennifer Richardson. Her research expertise focuses on how the psychology of emotions and emotion regulation can be used to improve the cognitive, emotional and behavioral health outcomes of numbers of
martialized communities with a particular focus on understanding and testing the efficacy of these strategies.
In the context of contending with discrimination.
She attended Yale University for her undergraduate degree, and was a research specialist at Princeton University for 2 years before entering her PHD. program.
She serves on the Yale Psychology Diversity Committee has served on the Yale Psychology Committee for Racial Equity and Justice, and has mentored over 10 undergraduate students both at Yale and other institutions
through mentorship programming. Carlos Gomez is a fourth year PHD.
Student in the biomedical engineering program at Boston University.
He works with Dr. Darren Robler at the biomedical optics, technology lab in the development of non-invasive, optical-based technologies in order to measure those
sternaclydeemosoid of patients in the Icu.
He graduated with bachelors of science and Medical Engineering from Boston University, with a constitution in Nano, technologies between his undergraduate studies and PHD. work.
Carlos worked as a research Technician in the optics and Martinos lab at Massachusetts General Hospital, in order to investate Alzheimer's disease.
Hannah Hawk is a fifth year PHD. student at the University of Chicago, and Developmental Psychology.
With her advisor, Dr. Alex Shah and a study's moral and social cognitive development with a focus on children's understanding of impartial procedures for group coordination.
She attended Kalamazoo College for undergrad, and a small liberal arts. boy.
Excuse me a small Liberal Arts school in this again, and went straight through from undergrad to graduate school. She worked as a research assistant, and Dr.
Alex Child lab. the summer before she applied to graduate school, which was a huge factor in her decision making.
She was also very interested and involved in Chicago's graduate worker, unionization efforts during her early years as a graduate student, Michelle Kim is the third year New neuroscience PHD student at the
Icon School of Medicine at Mount Sinai, where she is currently in the lab of Dr.
Holla Harani Nicholas. Her research uses Rodent models to study how isolation during development affects social behavior and neural circuits Reward and adulthood.
Michelle went to Grinnell College, where she viewed in psychology with a concentration in neuroscience, and after graduating from Grannell, Michelle worked as a research technician in a lab and
enter at and excuse me at Unc Chapel Hill.
She also spent a year serving full time in the National Surface Program Error Corps, where she worked with students in Chapel Hill public schools.
Michelle continues to be passionate about supporting science education.
She currently serves as a volunteer through bio bus.
The community organization dedicated to making science more accessible to students around New York City, and as a member of Mount Sinai's women in science, organization, and volunteers, with girls empowered in medicine and science, to help middle school
girls explore stem. So thank you to all 4 of our graduate student panelists today, and thank you all for the excellent suggestions for discussion questions.
We got a lot of questions which was super helpful in figuring out how to best Taylor.
This panel for the benefit of all of its attendees.
However, there was so many questions that we won't be able to get right to all of them. and so instead we're going to focus on 6 broad themes, and hopefully, at the end there will be time for any additional questions that folks might
have, and as that a reminder, while Ph. D. PHD.
Students share many common experiences, Every individual's journey is unique, and so gaining insights from a number of different people and a number of different graduate students at different schools and different programs.
Can help plant a more complete picture of what it is to be a PHD.
Student, and without further ado We're going to move into some of the questions for the panelists. So the first broad question is, how did you realize you wanted to do a PHD.
And so first we're going to start with Oja So Asha. how did you realize you wanted to do a PHD.
Thank you so much, Sophie. So I I think, how I decided that I I wanted to do a PHD.
Was through research experience and classes that I took during undergrad.
So I would say when I started my undergrad degree, I actually thought that I wanted to major in political science, and potentially become like a diplomat.
That's where I thought my career was going so I took some a lot of political science classes, and I also was gearing up to be a French major, because I took a lot of French.
In high school. So I pretty much thought that that was gonna be my double major, and therefore I would use those skills to do like foreign affairs.
But basically, after taking a a few semesters of political science and international relations courses, and essentially taking psychology courses for fun. I kind of realized that my interest kind of we're not in those classes I didn't really
enjoy the format of the debates. I was more so interested in like understanding, underlying cognitive and emotional processes, that essentially like Underly decision making.
So I thought I wanted to do decision making. that was sort of my first interest.
And so, I took a class with someone who happened to be the director of undergraduate studies, and I set up a meeting with her.
And I was basically just like I really like the psych material and I've been taking these classes as my final left electives.
But i'm thinking I actually might want to switch my Major. but I don't really have a sense of like career wise what I would do with that, because I you know, I hadn't really heard of you know where a
psychology could degree could take you And so she basically like she was awesome.
She laid out all of these different options that I could into that I could use and take that would lead me on a path towards it.
Either a PHD. or getting a masters in social work or switching to clinical psychology.
So she kind of talked about the sort of subfields of psychology in that conversation, and she was kind of like.
These are some pass you could take as a first step to for you to get a sense of what it would be like to engage more deeply with material.
You should think about being a research assistant in a lab.
So I Yeah. So I did that. and that was sort of where I got a better sense of. do.
I like the day to day of research. Do I want to like spend more time?
Learning how to ask better questions and formulate better studies. And so that sort of like set me on that trajectory, and I just kind of prioritized continuing to do research and doing some of programs that's great Thank
you about Shaw and Carlos. How about you? Yeah, I also some similar to directory.
But a little bit different. So when I graduate of high school, I really wanted to cancel buyer research that help cure cancer all that.
And I just need talking to this my family, who are really stem or people people that we kind of need a PHD.
To do that kind of recess at like a high end level was where it's time myself.
But through my schooling undergrad I can't realize chemistry and biology are not my very things to do.
I prefer to work more hands on our technology. stuff. with this i'm fine with my feelings so varied that I still could do like technical development of technologies.
And it wasn't until my last year where I was actually forced to do research.
Part of the curriculum. that I joined a neuroscience laboratory that, like specialized in developing new optical technologies, I was like, Wow, This is really fun.
I get to work. My hands build things, and the answers are looking are really unique and like, basically the boundary of what the humanity knows.
And science. So it's like okay I kind of want to do this.
But do I wanna commit to 5 years of this at least so it's like, okay?
Maybe not 5 years. I could do a masters but that is more financial money.
I have to invest preferring even decide. I paid.
Yes, but I also learn of the whole research technician system that you can do research as a interrupt tree level, where this is basically helping and tearing other people like postdogs and something's grass students in their own
research at a laboratory. So I applied for some of the jobs I got into one of them, and there I really just pretty much live the life of a researcher for 2 full years.
And at that point I was like okay i've done this for 2 years, and I don't hate it.
I actually want to keep going and continue this so I was like Okay, it's time to fly.
Apply for Pc: And I did Great. Thank you, Carlos.
Yeah, the the transition between undergrad and a position before going to graduate school sounds very informative.
Hannah, could you speak to how you realized you wanted to do a PHD: Yeah.
I think similar to what has already been said. A lot of it was kind of like getting some of that class experience, and that research experience that made me really in terms of considering what I wanted to do in the future, and the sort of things that I wanted to
do for my day to day. I think the research experience in particular was really informative to me in terms of what i'd be happy kind of living and answering these sort of questions for the next 5 years, and I actually studied something pretty unrelated
to psychology as an undergrad. So I did. I started off with philosophy, and did one kind of research assistancehip over a summer during my junior year, and it was just like so fun. and so exciting.
And I thought it was really interesting. and I think after that it was really the thing that kind of got me thinking about applying to PHD programs.
And I think the thing that's really nice about pHD programs in particular is that many of them do tend to be funded.
So if you're kind of thinking about a long-term option in which you're doing a lot of research?
It is a good option for that, for that reason as well. Great!
Thank you, Hannah. and then, Michelle, can you also speak to this question?
Yeah, for sure. Thanks so much for the introduction earlier.
So I mean it in psychology, and undergrad and when I first chose that, major, I wasn't really sure what I was going to do with it.
But I took a biology course, and in that biology course we did a lot of hands on laboratory experience.
That was like nervous size, adjacent, and that was really my first exposure to working in a live environment.
And probing specific neuroscience, related questions.
And I knew from that point forward that I definitely wanna see more of this I wasn't really sure what that would entail but I knew that I wanted to keep doing hands on research experience, and the more people that I talked to asking them, about
how I could do more of this particular thing. A lot of them kept telling me.
Oh, you know, like if you want to keep doing this particular thing, and you want to grow in your career as scientists.
You're probably gonna have to go get a pHD and
I didn't really know what that entailed either at the time, and so, after undergrad, I decided to work in a lab for a couple of years before deciding to apply to graduate school, and during that time I think
How how did I know I was ready? I honestly I didn't feel ready?
A lot of the time when I was in that in between period between undergrad and graduate school, and I think I think I was ready before I knew I was ready.
I heard from a lot of people around me that I was ready to apply to graduate school, but I had a lot of hesitant to about making that decision, because I knew that it was a big commitment.
I saw a lot of graduate students through my research technician position, and I saw how much work they had to do and how stress they were.
But I think the big exciting factor for me personally was that, when I was doing research at Uc.
Chapel Hill as a technician. my research was always tied to somebody Else's research or somebody else would always drive the research questions forward.
And I really wanted to have a chance to be able to do my own independent research, and to be able to ask the questions that I was interested in, and really your head that whole process, because I think one thing that originally really got me
into research, to begin with, was just the fact that you know, like I could come up with these questions and like I could decide how to answer them.
And you know, if it didn't work out and I would be the one who would make changes and like reshift the focus to take on a different approach.
So I think, wanting that independence and wanting that growth as a scientist was what ultimately led me to finally apply to grad school. Awesome?
Yeah, thank you all for sharing. And I think now this kind of nicely transitions into our next broad question, which is about what the application and interview process for graduates school was like in particular.
How did you also decide where to apply like how many schools?
What kinds of programs? as well as interview tips, and how you ultimately made the decision of what lab you want.
You worked in. So, Carlos, if you can take a first step at this question, that would be great.
Yeah. So basically to P. of how I applied I was thinking about first of all, where I want to live in cause I was in a relationship with someone.
So we had to really think about like, Okay, if we can move somewhere, if that means cars can treat like, look like the both of us have a successful career etc.
So that was was on my mind. for like the general areas Obviously it's flexibility.
There was a lot of communication between 2 of us and by just picked me.
Sure stays, basically, because this has happened to very, very co-line with the good programs I wanted to apply channels like good marketplaces, and I applied to 10 schools. once.
I knew the area. so I go. I pretty much looked into with universities.
Had the professors that would be interested in working with, and specifically that kind of research.
Because when I was supplying I was like okay I haven't a general deal, what I want to learn and with scales and and get the experience.
But like the specific research, I wanted to I was open to so I could look into a lot of different professors research, and that's when I start to get list of institutions.
I had at least 3 professors in them I would be happy to work with.
So that's I was like okay my 3 professor be happy to work with I'm definitely applying for this school.
And when the time came for me to actually to my interviews, I premises, as some help from some like of the people in lab, like what I expect for questions, all that stuff.
And they said it kind of varies to pay on what school is looking for, because some programs you sketch up to you.
It's just in and at that point you'll actually try and do the opposite.
Try and sell you on the school. So those were really straightforward and simple, but other ones like your premise being interviewed to be fit into a specific labs like I had to do a lot of research on the professor on like
the most recent papers, and, like the most current projects that I could see myself working to say, be like, Oh, what kind of resources do you see yourself doing in this laboratory?
So I have be great and give them like ideas. and so them how my goals and my expertise were aligned with them.
So I had to deal with background, which is on the lab and the professor himself.
And how do I also pick between to be here at Boston Room University?
Actually, it was kind of hard for me, mainly because the fact that at the end of the day I was between here and Columbia University.
So those are our stories, because mostly the fact that deep down it can't to the fact that Columbia University of the names is carries weight to it compared to Boston you don't even know what single is and that they have really good
school. The programs are about the same when the rankings get propped up.
But the professors would be working again for really prestige.
So I basically went to where would I be the happiest outside of school?
Because of the fact that a Pc. is very demanding.
I knew it's gonna be right to me like where am I gonna be happier when i'm not in the lab. Where will I feel comfortable?
And because Boston is pretty much been my home safe for most of my life.
I was like, i'm just gonna say in Boston great Thank you so much, Carlos.
And then, Hannah, what about you? What was the application and interview process?
Like as you were applying. Yeah. So I applied to 3 schools.
I was pretty particular, I think, about the location for sure.
As well as the professor fit. so I think one of the most important things that I've come to learn about graduate school and choosing graduate schools as i've kind of met you know students who are applying to go to
U. Chicago, and hearing about their experience. And this sort of thing is that I think similar to what Carlos says.
The location, and considering if you're going to be happy for those 5 to 6 to 7 years, that you're going to be at that location.
It is really important, and it does affect, like the work that you do.
How happy you are the relationships you make and I think sometimes. it can be tempting to kind of underestimate that effect of how it's going to be affecting your actual academic work.
But for me, I think, choose to be in Chicago, ended up being a really valuable thing for me, and I made some great connections that I feel like did an awesome job supporting me.
In times that were really hard for my you know, time and graduate school.
The other thing. Of course, I think Carlos also mentioned this.
Is it? It is really important to make sure that the professor that you're choosing to kind of work with regard.
Is kind of nice and supportive towards graduate students and also that it's, you know, Sometimes it does happen that you want to apply to work with one particular professor, but that Professor can leave for some unforeseen reasons whether it's
moving schools, or something like this, so similar to what Carlos says.
I think it was really important for me to think about whether or not there were other people at that institution that I could work with.
If my primary advisor was gonna was gonna not be there anymore.
Yeah. So I think a lot of those sort of factors eventually went into where I picked my school.
The other thing that I think is often good to mention is that in terms of funding some schools, do you have funding?
That is linked to specific advisors and some schools have funding that's linked to just the entire program in general.
I eventually ended up picking a program in which my funding wasn't linked to my advisor.
So you know, if anything went, hey wire he wasn't necessarily. signing my paycheck, which I think is an important or like a useful thing to have in a mentor mentee relationship. But you know those were just things
that were very important for me. but I think in General you know There, there's a lot of different factors that you can really think about and way and on how thank you for that Hannah.
And then, Michelle, what was the application and interview process like it for you? Yeah.
So I applied to 9 programs, and I decided on this program largely due to my research interests and seeing what professors were at these universities that fit my research interest.
So at the time when I was applying a graduate school, my main research interests about the neurobiology of substance use.
So I was really big on finding professors who also were interested in exploring those ideas.
I also applied to programs that were rotation based. So like, I think Carlos mentioned earlier.
For some programs you will apply to work specifically in someone's lab. But I was more interested in applying to the kind of program where during your first year, you can rotate in several labs and try out different lab environments and see which
one works best for you. So with that in mind, I made sure to pick programs where I would find multiple people that I was interested in working with.
Because I heard from a lot of people that you know.
If you like, Pigeon, pull yourself too much into working with like one particular person.
It could happen that that person might not have funding to take on a new student.
That person just might not want to take on any student in general.
A lot can happen between like the time you apply and that's the time that you enter a graduate school.
So just keeping in mind that, like that situation is always influx in making sure that there are multiple people that you could see yourself working with whose research interests align with yours.
I did not limit myself to you graphically, whatsoever, I like applied like all over the place, and if anything like looking back, that's one minor regret that I have because I after I had finished applying and after i'd gotten all
my decisions. One thing that I realized that like I really wish I could have done was move to be quoted to my family, and the way that I had made those decisions had made it such that that wasn't really possible so I would
definitely consider location and environment as a huge factor when deciding what programs to apply to.
And then also, just like as a part of environment. the cost of living in that particular location.
As I mentioned earlier, in terms of like funding from Hannah.
There are some funding packages that I received, and I looked at cost of living in that particular area, and I realize it will be while that program was really great.
It would be really difficult to financially pull that off. So there are certain programs that I had to eliminate just because yeah, just because of the cost of living in that particular.
So that is definitely a very real factor. in terms of preparing for interviews.
I definitely make sure to read up on the research that was happening in the lab that I was interested in.
I wouldn't say that you have to go like super in depth, and know, like every single thing about every single paper, but just have a general idea of how their research interests again align with yours, and like what you would bring to the table in terms of
that situation. and then my big advice would really be
Of course, a big part of your interviews is talking with faculty, but another big part of your interviews is talking with current graduate students, and those people are honestly gonna be some of the most valuable resources when it comes to helping you figure
out if you would be a good fit at that particular particular institution.
I think we have this idea that a graduate school interview is them interviewing you.
But honestly it's you interviewing that particular as well so, taking the time to talk to Chris, students see how they feel about their institution.
Are they happy in general? Do they feel supported? Yeah.
And then also, you know, these people are probably gonna be your callings and your peers in the future.
So you know, making sure that you say professional professional all the time.
A lot of them are probably gonna tell you like Oh, don't worry like I won't report back to faculty about like what you say here or like.
I'm not here to evaluate you but I think that's good rule of stuff is generally just to assume that, like people are always evaluating it like monitoring your behavior during the interview process.
So keep that in mind, and then I mean I think i'll get to this later. but, like ultimately picking who I wanted to work with was based largely on like making sure that I found a mentor who was a good fit
for me personally in terms of mentorship style. So I I decided to like compromise a little bit on the research question that I was interested in, to make sure that I found a mentor who would be supportive and a
healthy live environment, And I worked somewhere I could see myself being mentally and emotionally well, as well as like succeeding in my research.
That's great. thank you so much michelle and then Ajuga.
You mentioned earlier that you had a couple of different like tracks of psychology laid out for you.
So what was the application to PHD programs like for you?
An interview process. and how did you decide where to apply? Thanks, Sophie.
I I will just say I I sort of took a winding path towards figuring out where what my research interests were.
So I actually My first sort of research assistant position was like.
It was social and moral psychology. Then I worked in some clinical labs, and I worked with a social psychologist who did research with the public health focus.
And then I actually my full time, Ra: job. I was working with cognitive and decision, making psychologists. and ultimately I decided to do social psychology with a focus on diversity inequality and discrimination so I sort
of had a pretty wide sampling of different research questions.
Different projects and different methodologies, which I think was useful. I wouldn't necessarily say you need to do all of that to figure out what you want to do.
I just was looking for that that fit and so
And I think that sort of came just with exposure, like, I think my sort of full-time Ra.
Gig was extremely instrumental in like shifting my approach when it came to engaging with the sort of departmental academic community, because, as an undergrad you're sort of just you're almost like a customer, like receiving
instruction, and you're choosing the instruction you receive, so that you can complete your requirements and get your degree.
But as a as a research assistant, and as a graduate student you're you're more collegial in in terms of
The fact that you are open to collaborating with a bunch of different people, and you should be sort of seeing the folks that you interact with as colleagues and also in like a healthy departmental environment You would have that sort of
flexibility to get on research projects, and sort of explore different interests that you have with professors and grad students.
That you'd work with and that's definitely what I did, and I think that was also extremely helpful in figuring out my interest.
I think a lot have of really important themes have been like already mentioned that I feel like are extremely that I I see a lot of similarities.
So i'm not gonna spend too much time but I will say a couple of things with respect to preparing for interviews.
I think it's extremely instrumental to do mock interviews.
If you have the chance to. That was really really helpful to just not to just get over some of the nerves that you might be experiencing when you're just interacting with these people who are extremely high status and you want to impress them obviously because you're interested in working with
them right. So I think getting into that getting comfortable with that setting by sort of going through trial trial sessions is is helpful for you to not feel as much like stage right when you're sort of answering questions and
it's also allowing for like more preparation right for for that that interview, and I think a lot of what's been said in terms of like, How did I ultimately pick who I wanted to work with I so i'll
just quickly say that I only applied to like 4, 4, or 5 schools.
Yeah, So I was pretty narrow because I sort of knew what my research interests were.
And I also had a pretty clear sense of where I wanted to be geographically
And so I actually the person that I is my primary advisor.
She was at a different school, and I actually got information that she was switching universities.
So I actually then switched where my application was going to be, because I was very hyper focused on working with specific people.
But, as others said, I think michelle had mentioned this: that you want to be in an environment where you could see yourself working with or engaging with several professors.
I think that's extremely important. just because these folks will end up on your committees right for your departmental requirements all the way up into your dissertation.
So, in addition to wanting folks who you feel that they're interests are somewhat aligned in some to some degree with yours.
You also. you know, want to receive useful feedback for for your projects right?
So like you don't want to necessarily it it's great to get different perspectives, especially because my research interests are sort of like at the intersection of different disciplines.
Like. I do a lot of work that's relevant to clinical psychologists because it's a motion regulation focused.
Then specifically like emotion researchers, I can get a lot of insights from them.
And then also folks who have a focus on inequality and discrimination. Our their opinions are useful to me.
So it was important to me to sort of exist in the department where could get useful feedback from those folks?
Thank you, Ashra. that was all super helpful I guess There seems to be a couple of broad things that have brought up about applying to places where you yourself could see yourself living there for 5 years, and that the people that you're applying
to There, there's more than one person that you think that you would be enjoy working with.
So thank you all for those great insights. and now we're gonna move on to our third question.
So what is the typical day? look like in the PHD. life?
Look like for you? Or maybe a better question is, what does a typical week in a PHD.
Life. look like for you and to start us off. Hannah.
Can you take a stop at this question? Yeah, of course.
So I I think I think it definitely depends on your advisor style.
So. a lot of these questions will, I think, depend on your advisor style as well as the permanent style.
But typically, what I do in a week is, I have weekly or bi weekly meetings with my advisor, so it depends on the needs of our projects at a negative moment.
But we always typically will meet at least once a week to kind of talk about the logistics of projects as well as kind of broader general ideas of things that we're interested in conducting.
They the day to day of mine, has also changed a lot throughout the course of grad school.
So, for example, during early grad school, what I was doing a lot of is I was in a lot of classes.
I was trying to explore the department kind of get more of a general idea of what sort of research I really could do.
But then, as i've gotten older, and i've been finished with my classes and finished with my chips a lot of the research that I've been doing has become much more kind of narrow in terms of fitting a specific
research program that i'm trying to develop as a researcher and So I kind of have a sense of the collaborators that i'm meeting with with the projects that i'm trying to get moving across different stages so I had
are you guys Also, Another thing is that early in on the pro early end, on my grad school experience, it was a lot of kind of like brainstorming, actual data collection.
And these sort of activities, and then later, on of course it's a lot of writing.
So i've done so much writing I think in my past few years.
But really feels like it's. taken up kind of the bulk of my time in comparison to what I was doing early in grad school, and it's it's been a lot more synthesis within late grad
school than during early grad school. let's see so I i'm Sure these will also come up when other people talk.
But the I think the primary school that I learned during grad school one of the hard schools that I learned during grad school that I did not have as an undergrad was, are in particular.
So this is a data analysis tool that I really had no you know. I use Spss as as an undergrad, and kind of had no idea what it was.
But there's a lot of Classes in particular if you enter like a psychology, PHD.
Or something like this that will kind of get you teaching or fit you these hard skills. and they've been really useful for me.
So even if the classes are kind of outside of your requirements, I've taken a lot of them, and I thought they were both useful, interesting, and fun.
So yeah, awesome. Thank you so much, Hannah. And then, Michelle, what is this typical day look like for you as a neuroscientist?
For me. This really depends on what I have going on on any particular.
I guess, like in my research. So if I am in the middle of collecting data, usually in my day is such that I go in in the morning.
I try to structure my day. So I do like less active brain worky stuff. and the morning.
So you know, like writing emails? writing in general, like data analysis.
Catching up on reading in the mornings, and then usually I devote my afternoon early evenings running experiments, because I feel like for me, and just like my circadian rhythm that works better in general in
terms of how often I meet with my advisor. Yeah, I also meet with my advisor once a week or every Other Week.
We check in, and just yeah, see how i'm doing in terms of my projects.
And then We came up together with my project. And I think because the project is constantly changing and evolving, depending on what I have going on, and what data I collect a lot of it is really just like being
flexible, seeing what new directions we can take whenever we need with each other.
And then, yeah, putting that into putting that out there and then.
Just yeah, it can continue to like, stay open and keep an open mind in terms of
The data that comes in and like the progress that we make.
And then, yeah, when i'm not busy collecting data usually it's because I am writing for a manuscript, or for a grant proposal, or for you know, for an exam.
Of some kind. So during those phases most of my day is spent writing and reading.
So yeah, I'll just go into lab spend most of the day just looking at papers writing and sometimes some weeks up.
That's all I do. Thank you and then really quick Michelle. So for your what kind of materials do you guys use in your research program, as you're collecting data and analyzing data?
Did you know all these? Did you know how to use all these tools before you started your PHD?
Or was it easy to pick them up during your PHD.
Similar to what Hannah said I would. I was also not familiar with.
Well, I had learned. some are before I came into grad school, but I definitely have had to become more familiar with it during my PHD.
And then there are other data nows of programs that are much more would say, like user-friendly like graphic prism.
That have definitely that I was already familiar with going into graduate school because of my research technician work, and that I think in general, like in terms of the like skills are like the tools that I would say, I picked up during
graduate school as silly, or is like as minor as itself, like using a citation manager and just becoming really good at like organizing articles is a big skill I had to pick up. I would definitely recommend for anyone
out there? Who is anyone starting graduate school, or you know?
Or is it someone who is like interested in organizing what They're reading, start using the citation manager like now, and becoming familiar with how it works?
Because I think it's. a great resource for yeah organizing all these different papers that i'm sure you guys are reading and want to keep in one place.
And then, when you're writing, it's also super helpful so that you don't have to go in and put it all those citations manually, for sure, do you have a citation manager that you like to use I have been
using Botero this whole time. But i've also heard that end note is great, or I think the other one is like Mendela that I think people recommend.
But yeah, I I personally use those taro. I so thank you so much, Michelle.
And then, Ajuga, what about you? What is the typical day in the PHD life?
Look like for you. Yeah, So I just wanna say disclaimer that my days right.
I feel like the typical day Looks different. depending on where you are in your in your PHD program.
So right now. I'm a fifth year incoming sixth year.
So I have a lot more time to focus solely on research.
Earlier in my program. I had course requirements, and I had t-fing requirements, da requirements.
Where I right had to be in classes at a certain time.
And right like do the duties that are sort of associated with course work and tfing.
So grading assignment creation meetings to like coordinate stuff with the with the class.
Now i'm kind of just I have my like mandatory meetings.
I have my sort of weekly meeting with my advisor.
And then I kind of have to structure my day around pushing forward different projects, either related to manuscripts or my dissertation.
So I think I just wanted to sort of flag something that Michelle had said that I think as useful as that.
She had mentioned that she found that she was most productive.
In the afternoon. and I find that a most directive in the morning, and I think the the point of of we bring that up is just to say that you should figure out during your PHD.
When your brain is most efficient and sort of structure, your day around that right?
Obviously there will be constraints depending on where you are in the program.
But right, because I know that i'm most productive in the morning.
I try to do some of my harder thinking tasks in the morning right so like whether that be responding to reviewers on a manuscript or writing or reading.
I try to do those things in the morning because then when i'm a little bit tired I can do something that is a little bit less doesn't take as much of my brain to do right so for me that Looks like
analyzing data. just because once you learn how to analyze data, you kind of just apply that skill to whatever project that you're doing.
So I just wanted to say that I also wanted to.
Just say also that like Michelle, I use Ottero.
I use Otero as a citation manager be specifically, because I find that sometimes I find it very efficient to work with folks like collaborators via Google Docs and Zotero has a Google dog plugin which is great when you're
working with manuscripts. so that's my bias coming in, but just thinking about how your processes might be.
What what manager you would choose That would sort of work in tandem.
The best with your specific processes is just something to consider i'm trying to think.
Okay, just to to quickly touch on some questions about the question about funding and and conference presentations.
I think towards the beginning of my program. applied to right like fellowships. so like the nsf and the Ford cause they usually have the pre doctoral fellowships that you can you're eligible.
For I think up until your second year of grad school.
So I applied to those and similar types of fellowships.
Early on, and then randomly. If I found opportunities, I would just apply, sometimes between then and now.
Later in my PHD I they're sort of like dissertation related fellowships that i'm applying for now as well as some postdoc related fellowships.
So I think there just tends to be a lot of opportunities sort of early in your PHD.
Then more of a role towards them towards the middle. Maybe I mean just more interesting credit funding opportunities, and then more as you sort of get closer to finishing your dissertation.
I think. Yeah, hi! I'll I'll leave it at that Awesome. Thank you, Ojo.
Yeah, there's the conference funding or the funding that you can apply to you for your particular university versus.
The funding that is applicable through big national grants, like the Nsf of Nih is also good to be the key about
So thank you so much. And then, Carlos, could you also talk about what a typical day or week looks like for you as a PHD.
Student. Yeah, definitely, this one purpose at S, or one time meant it.
Those same sort of time as the proofure i'm now, and really the thick of my tsis resource.
So right now most of my things are me doing I like the real hands on projects, because i'm engineer, I've built things and like actually do a lot of validates.
And so the instruments I built. So as a lot of in the lab taking data stuff, I do have a general group mean I, my professor, has with me and other people in like the same sphere of stuff, and also a I mean with another the
pi where it's really good. for like good practices like When people have like any conference or thesis presentations, they need a practice. they just go there, and it's like a real audience, and feedback. that but the one thing I do wanna mention is
it really does depend on the Api. So, cause my P.
Is a little bit hands off so like early on I had to really email him like i'm so trying to figure out things can meet more regularly, and he he'd be glad to do that.
And it was just me trying to be like, Okay, this is my plan.
For so most seriously, the goals at least law school class realistics has.
I'll track with you expectations and that has actually really changed over time to now.
He actually has to email me to figure out what i'm doing and then it's a second it'd be like great you on track.
And me telling him what kind of projects ideas i'm pushing forward and the hands so that great keep going for good job for skills that I do because i'm the most technical person in the lab I have developed
skills. i'm not seeing software katie And so, like crane computer Aids assigns to the 3 print, and all of them have come through either classes or even my own hopping things of like Isis like to
code things for fun, and that's just really help just be applied for my own.
So and some of them were I learned through undergrads last, some nice to classes here to get experience as aggressing for funding wise to expand on the Grant wise.
So some grants can't support you in a program like the Nsf.
One you can actually apply as an undergraduate If you took some time off and the resignation job you can still apply as a undergraduate.
So was this what I did? and I actually got, and I opened up a lobsters for exploration and access had allow me to be select for any internal grants by the department because sometimes when you get a
funding scholars from a university there'll be specific cracks. only then you ever see No, so it's like giving it to you for being.
And while click top. Soon they wanna set off so those I would say, it's just try apply for as soon as possible.
Because a lot of these principles will have funding for like going off conferences and doing other things like entrepreneurships and open up the auditors for you. Awesome?
Thank you, Carlos, and thank you for talking about how like the day of the life of a PHD.
Student has changed from your first year through now. and I think that will nicely transition us to the next question which is related to like the work life.
Excuse me, which is related to what a week really looks like for you guys.
But how do you balance like work in life, and in particular, how do you balance like the relationship with your advisor and your work outside of graduate school?
And so first, we can have Michelle answer this question.
That would be great for sure. I think Now that I'm in a placement.
Phd. where i'm done with my course work and i'm mainly focusing on my research.
Right now. I am trying really hard to approach my research more like a 9 to 5 jobs, if possible.
Although this definitely depends on the current situation. like for example, I'm working on a grab proposal right now, and that is definitely not a 9 to 5 thing these days.
But it adds in flows, like there are other times where i'm able to going to live at 9 finish by 5, and then the rest of my time is, you know mine to do as I please.
So in those in that situation, you know work life balances very harmonious.
Other times it's kind of off-cilter but I think it's important to remember that and to keep in place.
Times are temporary. What it comes to communicating with my advisor about professional or emotional support.
Yeah, I think i'd like in the spirit of trying to keep my research more like a job.
I might be kind of an outlier in this regard.
But I try to see my pi more like my boss more than more than like up here, like a friend. So
I definitely turns my advisor for professional goals and professional support, and she's great she's been super supportive throughout my whole.
Phd. and she's honestly probably the most supportive pi I've ever seen in like my whole experience of working in different labs.
But when it comes to emotional or like personal support, I would probably turn to like.
I definitely turn to like my friends to my family instead of my and I think it's just because, like I need to compartmentalize those things, because if I like get to I think if I bring in like too much of like the personal and the
emotional and to live. It gets really easy for me to, for, like my own, like identity, to get wrapped up in that whole situation.
So I try my best like, divide my lab life, my my live self, and like my personal self.
If that makes sense when it comes to like make supports outside of blab.
I would say, like your cohort is your is a huge source of support. because you guys are all going to do the same thing together.
You guys can commiserate I would definitely also recommend making friends outside of your PHD program.
If possible, it's important to have people that you can talk about besides science, or besides research with So yeah, my friends here in New York have been a huge resource.
And then also, like just being diligent about saying in touch with friends from North Carolina, which is where I used to live before I moved.
Here has been huge outside of lab. I am big into running.
Running is a great way to clear your mind when you have a lot of stuff going on up here.
Thanks to your research. it also is a great way to to start with like work.
Life balance like if you are training for a race or something like that, you have to implement time into your schedule to training for the race, and that means you can't be spending all hours of the day doing research, for being
in lab, so that's also helps a lot with making sure that I can balance all of that outside of running.
I and trying to become a better cook. I think like also like cooking is a great way to kind of like separate.
My works off, and like my lifestyle like when I come home and be able to like actually like, take that time to like cook something for myself.
I think it's like a great transition period between whatever else is going on in lab.
And then, whatever else like I want to do with the rest of my evening
And then, when it comes to expectations, I think the big thing here is like being really upfront about your expectations, and then making sure that your advisor also has an opportunity to be upfront about their expectations from the beginning so
I would say like from the like when you first meet them.
In the beginning of your graduate school career, like just at them, straight up, you know, like what are your expectations for graduate students?
And then listening carefully to what they say. And then, as you continue to work with your advisor, keeping in mind like what they said about their expectations, and whether or not that their behavior aligns with what they said right and like sometimes
those things. what they say and what they do might be very different things, and you might find that, frustrating, or in Congress.
But I think another thing to keep in mind is to like.
Communicate your expectations as well for a mentor like how much mentorship you want, or how much involvement you want, and you know you and your advisor might be in different places when it comes to that.
But seeing where you guys can compromise or meet in the middle, and then also learning to pick your battles about certain things like like.
For example, my advisor is the kind of person who like.
If I give her a manuscript review like she'll come back, and it'll be like full of like all these very, very, very like minor corrections.
And at first like like about like wording, or like brazing and things like that.
And at first it was like really frustrating for me personally, because I didn't want like that level of micro management.
But I think like for me it's been a lot of like realizing, and things go.
And then but then also to like advocate for myself, when I do think that, like certain things like should stay the way like that.
I wrote them originally, or like explaining my perspective on why I wrote a certain thing or wife rates.
So I think a lot of it is like picking your battle, but also like standing up for yourself when you need to.
Awesome. Thank you so much, Michelle and Aja.
How about you? How do you balance your work in life?
I? yeah I would say I think sort of similarly to what some of us were saying before.
You depending on what is on your plate for a semester, or for a year.
This will sort of look different, because you just might be there's some semesters where you're just overloaded I'm thinking about, especially in our program here at Yale.
During second and third year. everyone is required to teach and some folks are still sort of finishing out their course, work. so some folks might be taking courses, teaching courses and still trying to conduct research, reading that they're going to be struck
for time essentially because there's a lot of responsibilities associated with all of those commitments.
So I think something I try to do at the beginning of each semester. not try to do, but I I do.
This is I make like a semester plan. which is, I mean right, that can it?
Sort of it starts with like what are the goals. that I want to sort of hit in terms of my research in terms of my writing in terms of also things that are unrelated to personal.
So that i'm i'm thinking about those things actively So if I start with those goals, and then I sort of back plan with like what joining to be accomplishing by the end of each month, and then what do I need to be public a
company accomplishing by the end of each week. And right And so I do that.
And obviously these these goals will shift and sort of be flexible, depending on whether or not, for example, you know, you might run into a snag with your data, which will then push like the timeline for data collection back
right. but you sort of have that structure that's just helpful to you in sort of thinking about like where you are, and what you're doing in the context of this like long road that is a PHD.
I think something else that I do that I feel like is useful is tracking my time.
I like to track my time, and I sort of like organize it into different categories, so like how much time am I spending, doing service?
How much time am I spending doing mentorship? related things?
How much time am I spending reading? How much time am I analyzing data?
This is just useful for me to get a sense of like one.
What can I even expect myself to do? in a given week which I think is extremely useful for figuring out how to plan effectively?
And then it's also useful to sort of get a sense of like what your boundaries might need to be like.
You might need you know you might need to more attention from your advisor, depending on where you are at the course of the project.
Because you just might be at a point where you might need to shift the research focus, or like crucially, critically, just like redesign studies.
Or does that design the next set of studies differently like those types of things, and that just might require more.
Feedback either your advisor, other professors or peers who are I think in terms of my support system.
I agree with a lot of the things that have been said.
I I obviously, I rely on my cohort and I I would say, we're we're much closer at the beginning of our time, just because you guys are all sort of taking similar required courses and having to teach you become
less connected as you go for further along on your program. but I still talk to them right like relatively, frequently.
And I also like work with them. like. cause we all have the common goal of trying to write our dissertation right now, and get our manuscripts out.
So that's been a big support system and then similarly to what Michelle said.
I have a lot of friends outside of my program who I hang out with, but some of them also just are in programs like I have a friend who's studying for the bar right now, and I just haven't gone to work to do so I
was literally earlier today. we just had like a 2 h study block even though we're doing totally unrelated things.
It was nice, because right? I was not in my normal lab environment, which was, I think, stimulating.
And you also get to see people that you don't otherwise see I think in terms of interest.
I they shipped. I I used to be heavily involved, so I I did a lot of
I do. I trained in classical ballet growing up, and I did a lot of like dance related stuff in college and even into the PHD.
But that has taken a back seat, just as my research load has sort of taken off, and also with the pandemic for me.
I do a lot of I try to do a lot of body work because I find that it's really useful for regulating my mood.
So whether that be doing cardio at the gym or doing Pilates or Yoga.
I think that's another way. that I can between like the work day and like my time at home, i'll often use like that type of body work to like mark the difference.
So I often do it like right after i'm done with work
And I feel like it's quite relaxing for me. but you should find what is relaxing for you like knitting is also something I like to do.
Like to listen to music, You know just you know figuring out what you like and just kind of doing it, and finding like minded people who have similar interests.
I think, is something that's worth investing time into and then i'm just gonna quickly try to what Kennedy should you do.
If you realize your expectations. I think to quick, just to quickly answer this.
I will just say Your expectations will shift as Well, because you'll be at a different point in your PHD.
And you'll have different skills right like. There will be There will be things that you know how to do.
That you will need feedback on that you did, maybe in your first or second, or even third year of your PHD.
So you will be You'll notice that you'll become more independent, and you'll also notice that your advisor will probably give you less. There'll be less micromanage depending on where you are so
I think as Michelle said, asking what their expectations are, and then taking note of where you are in terms of learning and other researches, you can count on meaning like older grad students, and post talks in your lab is a good way to
like help You make sure that you're getting the support you need without sort of like. always going to one person. awesome.
Yeah, Thank you so much, Ojo: And then, Carlos, what about you?
How do you balance work in life? Yeah. so high balance is found.
I found the system for myself, where I actually kind of work backwards from figure out expectations and deadlines of things.
Having all of like the dance. I have that kind of it'd be like months away 2 weeks away, and putting them into like a prior killer.
So like, Okay, this is a top priority, but I have like 3 months that can be a little bit lower versus like the small thing with this 2 smart and then countless plan out.
My we can see like, Okay, if this can be a lot of work of like in lab or is being a lot of rain, because I have gotten out that I've always, you know, always knowing this about me.
I hate rain of 8 past now, we'll procast me and dare you think before I do that, So when I have big things to write like papers or my perspective, I just blocked weeks off just to go right with some small data
analysis error to make myself a real just actually do that in real time.
And but other than that, I really try to have a not 9 to 5.
That's myself, said, but a very versus schedule mine's like 9, 10 to 4, and then I work and the evening less late night Student Dan analysis at home is in between. I Do go to Jim and cook for myself and
to like. get some clearing my head, because the is completely put my phone and anything like trying that anyone could connect to me and says, do my own thing.
The cutting, the purses I have is, as everyone can already mentioned, is the core herd. they really are the closest people to.
Haven't seen life experience as you are currently because they're in same program.
They have the same institutional problems this is something that will be introduced, dependent and like.
Let us know what's going on what if you are in tune with you.
Then, like other people, would And this is great, for like just talking complaint, because they want including you on complain. you can do that over beer, and says, have a good time.
Because everyone does even like to. I think even the pis will do that with their own cells. that will have things.
So it's a very common tropes to that in all of academia
And they also get into the system. because when you have problems and you don't know if this is a new problem, or if it's okay institution problem, you can ask them like, hey?
Like my friends have asked me like my P. is not like me doing interested zoom pi like that.
And then we all tell our own experience. like oh, my api's really open.
We tell them. Oh, may talk to the graph soon. advisor with controls all of the grass things like problems.
You can go to them confidently and tell them things give them advice also, like if there's ever any process like Siphans
My university is this past summer those are big a drop in admin where a lot of people, Miss Pacex, and because you are as sense to getting paid the same as you I heard you talk to him like hey?
I didn't get my paycheck did you get your pay check, and then you can all figure that, and then you'll add the right people together to make things be fixed.
Quickly. So that'll great for both technical and and this questions also for complaining.
For interest. I do outside lab. personally, I try find
Obviously our still kind of line with things I like to do like I do I'm doing a Pc.
Because I like doing the things. but i'm trying I try to find hobbies like building lego sets and photography customer artistic.
There's no like goals that Have to me. This is there for me to express myself, and take my mind off things, But, yeah, feel accomplished when I find them.
Are do them because and a very stem oriented Pc.
That's always like that lens is always expectations papers is gain Getting a few published, or not. there's always like merits that you have to meet.
But when we have free form hobbies they are wherever you want them to be, in a way to just freely express this stuff.
Awesome. Thank you so much, Carlos. And then Hannah came.
You talk about how you balance work in life at Chicago?
Yeah, I think similar to michelle for me it's been really important to try to keep my work life and my personally very separate.
So I also treat my research like a 9 to 5, when I can.
Sometimes they do bleed under each other but I really do try to keep those things in my life a little bit separate, and I think that it's not something I really did at the beginning of graduate school.
It's something that I started doing during the pandemic and pretty for me.
At least that's made my perceived quality of life a little bit easier.
But you know it's definitely like a personal personal thing So for support systems.
I also have a mix of people within the program that I feel like I can talk to.
I think a lot of partlessness points were really great in terms of like comparing what is and is not normal in terms of what your advisor is like letting you do or not letting you do having these people that you can talk to
regardless of whether or not your research interests are really different.
Just in terms of like structurally and logistically what do things look like for you is something that's really useful.
And I also do have friends outside of the program sometimes it's really nice to just kind of like not be talking about work all the time, and for me that's been a really valuable aspect of my life in
Chicago. I will say having a good advisor, or like an advisor who, you know, takes you seriously and like, considers your needs and is thoughtful towards you.
And your work schedule is really important. My advisor in Chicago is awesome.
He's really really he's been really awesome and I think has been really responsive to the things that I have said that I prefer in terms of work schedule i've had friends within my department who have had really
bad look in terms of meeting advisors, and have really kind of struggled and suffered over it.
So I think if there's you know kind of a thing that's really gonna make or break your grad school experience, it's whether your advisor is respectful towards you and it's you know very unfortunate but a lot of different
things in graduate school whether it's your research or your schedule, or what your day-to-day looks like, or highly dependent on your advisor, in a lot of these ways.
So for me, when I have a conflict with my advisor, I just kind of talk to him, and typically it gets resolved.
But but you know i've known many people who haven't really had that privilege, and have really suffered as a result from it.
And things that I do outside of the lab. I really like to draw
I really like painting, and recently i've started to play badminton, which I think has been really fun.
Yeah, that's awesome. thank you hannah I really appreciate all of that.
And now we're gonna move into I think our last big question for today.
So what happens after a PHD. a lot of folks were interested in what sort of career options there are for people who complete a PHD.
What your goals are so whether you're interested in academia or industry, and how you see pursuing that So I think you've can answer this question first.
Sure. Yeah, I So how do I maintain my passion.
That's a great question. I think I think a lot of. I think the way that I would probably answer this is that I think going to talks in areas that are unrelated is really has been really helpful for me
just because i'm not unrelated to your research question but like not necessarily in your department is basically what i'm saying, I think that's been really useful to me, because I think hearing how other people are thinking about problems that
you're thinking about. helps me one gain some perspective on like what my role is as a researcher in like my field, like what are the contributions that I can make with this work to like just people's general knowledge about like a
topic. what are What are ways that you can approach this topic that are very specific to your area?
I think right It it I will say like it your ability to figure out to find these types of talks has a lot more to do with, maybe like your research interests.
I mean because I study stuff that's at the intersection of all these different things.
It's definitely easier for me to find talk but I would say, like you know, some of the sort of most like academically stimulating moments have been that i've experienced like over the course of this page d program
have come from me going to an unrelated talk that had something to do with something.
I was vaguely interested in hearing this person talk about their work, and then thinking about problem that I've been sort of grappling with in a different way.
As a result of like how they were thinking about a topic.
So that really helped, and it actually eventually likes spawned this like new line of research that i'm doing that's unrelated to my my primary like dissertation topic.
And I think that's the point right like you obviously yours so much more than like this thing that you've like decided to dedicate these years to
But you're also developing so many skills and talents
That will impact that have greater impact than like this one sort of like a vessel that you're you're putting your energy towards
And I also think having sort of different things going on Helps gives you some.
Is giving You it. it. It sort of forces you to give space to, maybe what your primary research area is, or like the one set of studies that's like the next set in your like main body of work, which I think is is really
healthy, like, I would say, taking time away from my main project, doing something related to a side project, and then returning back to my main project, then also gives me some mental space, which is, I think, necessary for like doing good work, and then
Okay, i'm gonna skip the lesson I think August one, for right now, because I have to think about that.
But how do I deal with failure, Burnout, and all of these things that are listed?
Which is such a huge question and topic, I think what I will say is, I remember during my first year of graduate school I was very.
I had. I did not have a good sense of boundaries between like work and personal life, and it's you have a lot of responsibilities.
And it's like you're in this community of people that you think is like you're dealing with the impostor stream of of it all. and I would say like I learned a lot during that year like what my limits
were because I was pushing myself to my limits and like past them, you know.
Just like I really had to become better at like planning.
And considering myself through scheduling too much, doing too much, not getting enough sleep.
All of these things that led me to right like feeling super burnt out at the end of my first year, meeting a lot of sleep, and needing to like figure out, how can I make this sustainable for me because it's very
much a marathon and not a spring. So thinking about like the working, the longevity of of that you need to like.
Do this major thing turn in the dissertation?
I think you kind of learn by doing and sort of doing improperly.
I I would say I feel like the strongest lessons that i've learned have been through like mistakes that I've made essentially like I really had to sit down after that like really bad burnout period and figure out like how do I need to organize
my life, so that i'm you know obviously progressing but i'm not like doing so in a way that's unhealthy, you know.
I think some of the the aspects of the question that have to do with sort of into personal issues and biases.
And maybe a touch of imposter syndrome.
I think as you advance in your PHD.
You will learn soon. learn that within your sort of department and environment you're the expert on your material.
You're the expert of the study. that you're creating You're the expert of the data that you're collecting right like you should build confidence because you know what you spent the most time sort of putting your eyes on I
think you know, after obviously you have you're working with experts in like the the fields that you're interested in, but in terms of like who is spending the time on this specific project that you're working on that's
you. So you should like Walk with that confidence and then I think you start realizing that people are obviously extremely smart, but might may not have the domain knowledge that you're building
Over the course of your PHD. So you get a better sense of like, Okay, Who's opinion?
Is actually Do I need to really take into strong consideration and who's just sort of being critical for the sake of being critical?
So like learning to like who to listen to and to listen to yourself better is, I think, a big part of of dating confidence during the PHD.
Because people will always have something to say but it's like you know what your research is is designed to do, and like the questions it's designed to answer.
So some people's comments might actually not be relevant to the work that you're specifically doing. And so learning to temper.
That is, is a skill that you developed in terms of career options.
I am I i'm interested in pursuing academia, so i'm i'm committed to taking that track, so I I do want to do a postdoc and I do want to apply for jobs after that
but I will say like if you're if you know that you don't want to do academia.
There are a lot of opportunities one to do internships or 2 to just like, apply your research expertise to a problem that's not as narrow. Academically, it's.
Just I think it's a lot in terms of getting those types of positions.
It's a lot more about like who you know I think or who you're able to talk to.
So if you know that you don't want to do academia. often at schools there will be some sort of group That's organization.
That's set up that's dedicated to like helping PHD.
Students transition out of academia and into industry and that's definitely a resource.
But if you know you don't want to do academia you should take advantage of, because then you actually you'll one you'll get access to training.
But you also get access to opportunities. okay, I'll leave it again as awesome.
Thank you, Otra and Carlos. What about you? What do you?
What happens after your PHD. What do you think about thinking about doing next? Yeah.
So i'll just go through both points the way I keep from passing for
My research is learning how to take time off and that involves literally I've worked. i've found my way.
Let's keep my way to commence my pi texas let me have 2 weeks off once a year, where he cannot contact me.
I, you see, somewhere very foreign like that last summer was Alaska.
So there was no way I was gonna have the signal and so just being able to find ways to complete drop everything suspect I'm done.
Everything is as is this: leave it as this and come back to press news eyes and again excite to keep working on this because we do miss doing the things and i'll just skip the the lesson because it kind.
Of also imposter syndrome. But the ways to deal with failure and burnout kinda.
I feel like Bruno comes a lot with you, trying to push yourself and feel like you keep failing.
But you have to realize that you didn't the newest kind of research.
You're more likely to fail than anything and like failure is just new proving something is not possible cause really doesn't mean it's bad.
It doesn't work a lot of times when just experimenting that you could have a very clever idea It just works off the first time, or you can just do the other way with this you try a 100 times since.
It's find the one good solution and right that often sunset.
But and there's a lot of failure it's kinda stuff that Well, I prove it doesn't work.
Okay, keep trying something else. and for impostor syndrome.
For me. That was a hard problem with the fact that i've always been afraid of saying stupid.
It's really really smart people, especially when like group means people would be ideas about things, and I would have some.
But I would just hold my idea back so free. and
It took me long realize there's this kind I spent all an idea it's just like no bad idea is a I get to discuss and keep thinking about, and after hearing a lot from a post. office.
I really admire his technical expertise and his career path, that he was pretty much saying the same thing.
I was thinking, like 10 min later, that my idea is actually not bad.
And the solely allowed me to grind to me. Realizing I am eventually going to be the expert on the thing.
I should be confident, knowing that I will know everything else, especially when at my alert years and the career that my pi keeps asking me for refresh like, Oh, wait!
It was this and handbag Now, I was i'm telling like No, it's actually this way, and not that way, and that's just help build conference.
And knowing that, I am the expert at the end of the day and for me career options, i'm actually gonna do something in the middle, not academic in our industry, i'm thinking of doing a national laboratory So
It's kind of like the very research kind of level of things where, like you, still trying to kind of access all things.
But there, those national libraries are you see funded directly by the government through, mostly like defense contracts where like they have a cool process.
But they're always trying to either. do it directly for defense, Or is this for like nasa stuff, I swallow them speakest resources. so all that where you can just do research and be less worried about the whole
academic cycle. the the really is you can itself awesome.
Thank you so much, Carlos. And then, Hannah, how about you?
What are you thinking of doing with your pHD since we're running out of time?
I'll just focus on this last question so what i'm gonna do after.
So I am actually planning on going into industry. So if anybody has any particular questions about what that looks like.
I'm happy to you know if you have my email I'm also happy to like kind of talk about it with you.
But yeah, it it was for me I think the decision that I basically didn't make until maybe like 2 months ago, or 3 months ago.
And a lot. it's along I think with one of the lessons that took me the longest to learn personally, but it really took me a long time to kind of square the fact that, like you know.
I love research. it's amazing. but like it's not my self-worth.
I'm like if you know when research goes well I was always like Wow, it's so amazing, i'm so amazing.
But when it went poorly it was always kind of like Oh, no, i'm not worth anything or the sort of thing.
So I think square it. It goes along with separating my work and my personal life as well.
But I think squaring these 2 parts of myself have been a particularly important part of graduate school, and in general kind of like having this sort of very specific and passion-oriented type of work.
Experience. But yeah, absolutely thanks, Hannah. and then Michelle What about you?
I know that you're still a little bit earlier in your career?
But what are you thinking about doing? after? your PHD Yeah, I mean people keep telling me it's never too early to start thinking about what you want to do after your PHD: So
Yeah, I think right now is like a really exciting time for people in some Phds to think about what they want to do after their PHD.
Especially when it comes to thinking about stuff outside of academia, like people have mentioned industry, I think, like you know, with you, that, like spans like biotech startups to like large pharmaceutical companies, people, also get into
like science, writing and communication, science, education, site, outreach
People started also going more into like consulting fields I don't really know as much about that.
But i've heard that's very impressive or like policy and government.
Those are also positions that people can pursue after their sem PHD.
Personally for me. I have decided that I would like to be an academia, if possible, but not to become a pi
I think I realize. One thing about myself is that I really enjoy supporting people in the research.
But maybe like not necessarily with all the baggage that comes with like having to be a pi, and like like rants, and like run that whole enterprise.
So I think right now. i'm thinking about maybe being part of a core facility or working in like research support, whether it's like in grants and contracts.
Or yeah, maybe becoming like a staff scientist in like at Nih.
So. those are just a couple of my ideas so far awesome.
Thank you so much, michelle and then as a one last super quick lightning round. we're gonna have all the panelists answer like, what is the one piece of advice that you would give your praise pHD student self and
Carlos, if you could kick us off, that would be great.
Yeah, one prize help would be skipping re allowed papers It's something that I always not found the most exciting thing, but like it's always good to expand you know.
Also, and everything was happening. most newest things in the field.
Awesome, great advice, thank you, and then Hannah what is one piece of advice that you'd give your free PHD.
Student sales. I think I don't know more more like life stuff like for me.
It was probably finding my network and making sure that I had a community that was there to support me.
I found it eventually, but I think it was something that I underestimated upon upon entering grad school absolutely.
And Michelle. What about you? I would say that so in graduate school?
You're expecting to work new skills and like of course, like that. The reason you go to graduate school is to learn new skills.
But the thing about learning these skills is that you have to be bad at first before you become good at it.
But I would say like being okay with the fact that like becoming being bad at something at first is not a bad thing like that's just part of the process, and like to not a avoid doing that thing because you're bad at it like the
only way you're gonna get better at it is to keep doing the thing.
So in order for you to become good at something you have to be bad at adverse.
Don't don't be discouraged about It I think oh, like early on in my grad school career I spend a lot of time being down on myself, because I felt like I was bad at so many things absolutely great advice and then
i'm sure what about you it's one piece of advice that you'd give your pre PHD student self.
Yeah, I I think I would say use all of the experiences that you have during your PHD.
As like opportunities to learn things about yourself and about others that will be useful in a lot more context than you think.
I think right like PHD programs are so demanding but they're also like rich opportunity spaces.
And so just doing a lot of self-reflection and using your experiences as opportunities for self reflection is super key for getting the most out of it.
Awesome. Well, thank you all so so much and thank you to our 4 fabulous panelists today for helping us get a little bit more insight on what it's really like to be a PHD.
Student in all of these different programs at all of these different institutions.
So here, thank you to you all, and I will hand off to Wiji to end this panel for today great to hear.
I couldn't have given better advice and thank you all it's amazing how much inside you all brought to the table.
I hope that. and people here will also I mean first of all good luck with the choices that's the Sds have to make in their own careers, and I hope that you also check out future growing up in science
events which will be posted on the website and on Twitter.